One of the main concerns many people have from other faiths is that for certain sins within the Mormon church the members need to confess to their Bishop. LDS bishops are considered “judges of Israel” and therefore the concept is they sit in judgement in place of the Lord. This practice isn’t uncommon as I know the Catholic church also has confession.
I’m unfamiliar with the history of confession and if someone knows, that would be great to add to the comments. I did however go through the scriptures and see what I could find scripturally in support of or against confession to a person rather than the lord.
Conflicting scriptures:
| Morm. 8: 20 |
man shall not . . . judge: for judgment is mine. |
| D&C 20: 13 |
by them (the scriptures) shall the world be judged. |
| John 12: 47 |
I judge him not: for I came not to judge the world. |
| Mosiah 29: 12 |
better that a man should be judged of God than of man. |
Scriptures of People judging in place of Lord:
| Obad. 1: 21 |
saviours shall . . . judge the mount of Esau. |
| 1 Ne. 12: 9 |
twelve apostles . . . shall judge the twelve tribes of Israel. |
| Morm. 3: 18 |
twelve tribes of Israel, who shall be judged . . . by the twelve whom Jesus chose. |
| Morm. 3: 19 |
this people . . . judged by the twelve whom Jesus chose in this land. |
Lord is judge:
| John 5: 22 |
Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son. |
Final Judgement:
| D&C 29: 12 |
to judge (Christ’s apostles) the whole house of Israel. |
| D&C 137: 9 |
Lord, will judge all men according to their works. |
| Alma 11: 41 |
rise from the dead and . . . be judged. |
| Alma 41: 3 |
men should be judged according to their works. |
I would love to hear peoples’ thoughts on why or why not is it necessary to confess sins to clergy?
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April 2, 2008 at 2:22 am
J. Stapley
The BoM also talks about the Church guarding against the distribution of the Lord’s supper to those who are not penitent. See also Mosiah 26, where it discusses the confession of sins and the establishment of the Church. The D&C also talks a lot about confession. The NT also frequently makes reference to confessing our sins. All these sources either implicitly or explicitly espouse a public or semi-public confession.
Mormon practice has developed over time, but I tend to view the Church is the guardian of the sacraments. We therefore typically confess to the Bishop those things that either effect the Church as a whole or that jeopardize our standing within the Church.
It is important to understand, however, that it is God who forgives.
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April 2, 2008 at 3:15 am
Mormonzero
I am not entirely sure. I believe that the bishop should be there as a mediator in difficult circumstances where the individual or individuals involved are having a hard time finding peace after a improper decision.
In my personal life I personally believe that by taking the sacrament I am PUBLICLY CONFESSING my sin. Each person, each week will undoubtedly sin and I believe the sacrament is public acknowledgment of sin and recommitting ourselves to God. I don’t see taking the sacrament as strictly a question of worthiness but rather a question of “have you exercised your faith and repented of your sins.”
It is interesting though b cuz in places like institute and seminary one of the most common questions I can remember being asked was “which sins need to be confessed to a bishop?” A how far is too far? type of thing.
Just my initial thoughts.
Ama49
Intriguing topic; I hope to see a lot of comments.
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April 2, 2008 at 4:58 am
hawkgrrrl
For sins that are pretty serious, I always thought it is because the person who has committed the sin has lost the spirit and is not able to be objective about the repentance process or to determine when forgiveness is obtained. It’s easy to feel hopeless or unforgivable unless there is someone there who still has the spirit to “coach” you back to having the spirit.
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April 2, 2008 at 7:42 am
LDS Anarchist
I wrote two blog posts on this topic already. They contain my current understanding of the doctrine of confession.
Are we commanded to confess to ecclesiastical authorities without witnesses?
The law governing confession
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April 2, 2008 at 12:56 pm
mormonzero
IMO sacrament is a form of public confession. You go to church to renew baptismal covenants. In my mind partaking the sacrament is acknowledging that you are demonstrating your faith and culminating your repentance process.
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April 2, 2008 at 6:39 pm
Dan
Like the first comment, I believe that a lot of info can be found in Mosiah 26. The whole chapter is worth reading in regards to this discussion but particularly where the Lord is speaking to Alma and states:
29 Therefore I say unto you, Go; and whosoever transgresseth against me, him shall ye judge according to the sins which he has committed; and if he confess his sins before thee and me, and repenteth in the sincerity of his heart, him shall ye forgive, and I will forgive him also.
30 Yea, and as often as my people repent will I forgive them their trespasses against me.
31 And ye shall also forgive one another your trespasses; for verily I say unto you, he that forgiveth not his neighbor’s trespasses when he says that he repents, the same hath brought himself under condemnation.
Here the Lord states that confession is to be made to ecclesiastical leaders and to the Lord. However, it is the Lord that forgives.
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April 2, 2008 at 7:32 pm
ama49
#1 and #6
Thanks for your comments and for the scriptural references.
For our friends from other christian faiths who may not believe in the Book of Mormon, do you have any references in the Bible?
#1…you mention there are references of confession in the NT. Do you know where?
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April 2, 2008 at 10:27 pm
Jay
I have always been told that the Bishop doesn’t forgive sins and he doesn’t. He merely acts as the “gate keeper” to the temple and sacrament ordinance. With that said, I think people go to the Bishop way too much. IMO the Bishop is more of a counselor for those that need him than someone we are required to confess to.
All these sources either implicitly or explicitly espouse a public or semi-public confession.
It’s been awhile since I’ve heard a nice public or even “semi-public” confession (Oh wait, I never have), so what are we LDS members doing wrong? Maybe we should have a sacrament meeting just for public confession like we do for testimonies. I think that would be very entertaining.
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April 2, 2008 at 11:35 pm
ama49
#8
You’re funny. I think it would be great entertainment to hold a public confession (sometimes testimony meetings do turn into that and I get a little uncomfortable). Maybe our Sacrament meeting attendance would go up if we did that : )
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April 2, 2008 at 11:38 pm
ZeeZrom
I agree with Jay. Public confessions from the pulpit would totally get my a** back in the pews at church! That would be a good show! Unless people started confessing the teeny, tiny things, like punching their sister in the arm or calling their friend a bad name or something. Or if they became really bland and the exact opposite of what they’re supposed to be. Kind of like how most testimony meetings turn into “thankimony” meetings. Talk about boring. I can see it now, “umm, I don’t really have anything to confess. I just wanted to come up front and say I’m so happy that we have the opportunity to confess in front of each other. Well, I guess I did look at a woman lustfully the other day, but I already prayed about that. So anyway, I think this is the greatest ward in the world. Isn’t our bishop just so awesome?!? I love all of you. Thank you again for being here for those of us who need to confess. In the name…. you know the rest.
-Z
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April 3, 2008 at 12:41 am
mormonzero
Is there any verse that addresses the need for a person to confess their sins “privately to a bishop” or ecclesiastical leader. When I read these verses I don’t see anything that makes me directly correlate “public confession” with a “private confession to a bishop.” I am somewhat partial to the idea that rather than the sacrament being solely a worthiness issue it is actually the final step (renewing ones determination to do God’s will) of the repentance process. Thus, we are publicly admitting to our sinful nature rather than simply our worthiness when we partake of the sacrament, which is presided over by the bishop. I see it as we are demonstrating our worthiness to go through and finish the repentance process–renewed and refreshed. The bishop is there for private consultation when an individual is having a hard time finding their way back to the spiritual comfort provided by repentance. This line could be somewhat different for each individual but I also agree with Jay in that I think some ppl go to the bishop too obsessively and become dependent on the bishop for spiritual purity. However, it would be very difficult to tell exactly when someone should and should not go to the bishop.
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April 3, 2008 at 12:42 am
mormonzero
sorry, I am new here I hope no one minds me chiming in from time to time.
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April 3, 2008 at 4:53 am
ama49
#11
I appreciate your comments and feel free to stop by anytime.
As I originally said in the post, I’m not sure exactly what the history of confessing to the bishop is…I’m going to do some more digging around and hopefully others will provide some good insight as well.
Did you check out the post on comment #4?
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April 3, 2008 at 11:40 pm
mormonzero
Yes, I followed the link by #4. W/O doing an adequate and proper study of the topic I have to say I agree with him.
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April 4, 2008 at 12:27 am
Lucy Stern
I think we have to confess to the Bishop so that he can help us get back on the right path. I think the main confession we should make is to the Lord himself thru prayer. So far, I have not done anything that would require confessing to the Bishop. I pray that I never get far enough off the path that I have to…….Nice post.
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April 4, 2008 at 1:31 am
J. Stapley
There are several NT references to John the Baptist baptizing those that confess their sins. James 5:16 is the historical basis for the Catholic rituals of extreme unction and viaticum. 1 Johnn 1: 9 and Acts 19:18 are general indications of confession.
Early Mormon practice was typically geared toward public penance. There are a number of reasons we typically don’t do that so much anymore, some legal, but mostly I think it is an evolution of Mormon covenant relationships.
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April 4, 2008 at 1:59 am
T F Stern
We had a fellow bear his testimony last week and as he began he confessed about not coming to a complete stop at stop signs, which apparently weighed heavily on him. I did my best to keep from letting go with a belly laugh. Maybe it’s not just me, from the comment section I see I’m not alone, it made for a very fun meeting.
I’ve sat in Bishop meetings to take notes during these events and I came away with a better understanding of how the Lord desires each of us to begin the repentance process with real intent, not half way. I’ve felt the great concern and love expressed in these very open exchanges and conversations and know that this is the way the Lord wants it done; not at the pulpit as a public humiliation for the entertainment of those in attendance.
Those who are in such a situation as to require a church court have used up all their energies with worry and regret or have yet to face the consequences for their actions and are too proud to admit fault. Two things I’ve noticed; those who show up will win the battle because they have faith in the Gospel principles, those who avoid coming fall away and leave the Church.
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April 4, 2008 at 2:01 pm
Standing Solus Christus
Do you believe that Jesus Christ is a sufficient mediator between you and the Father?
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April 6, 2008 at 6:42 pm
ama49
#16
Thank you for your New Testament references and your thoughts on why there isn’t public confession. This is very helpful.
One thought I had was that in most of the references in scripture under “confession” it appears that confession to the Lord is of most importance and confession to a leader is rarely mentioned at all. There are relatively few examples of confessing to a man that stands as representative of the Lord (Numbers 21:7 was the only one I found).
There are some references of confessing one to another collectively, one of which you mentioned(James 5:16; D&C 59:12).
How then do we know when it is necessary to confess to the bishop and where does this come from? is it from the days of Moses or from other revelation? Or…is confession in these scriptures just implied that we’re confessing them to a leader? What are your thoughts?
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April 6, 2008 at 6:45 pm
ama49
#17
I also appreciate your insights and personal experiences with confession and thoughts on why there isn’t public confession.
I also appreciate your thoughts on confession and not going half way, but all the way.
I do have a few questions for you.
1. You mention going to the bishop and only repenting “half-way.” Are you implying that to repent all the way one needs to go to the bishop?
2. If the answer is no, then at what point does one need to go to the bishop?
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April 6, 2008 at 6:57 pm
ama49
#18
I really appreciate you stopping by and sharing your question. I assume from your question that you are inferring there is no need for a bishop or any other clergy for confession.
I will share with you my personal beliefs on this matter.
I believe that we (all men and women) sin and fall short of God’s glory. I believe that there needed to be an atonement made for us in our behalf and that Jesus suffered for our sins in the Garden of Gethsemane and died on the cross. I believe that salvation and deliverance comes as a result of Jesus’ sacrifice and forgiveness for our sins comes from us praying to the Lord and it is He that grants us the gift of forgiveness. We can know we are forgiven through the power of the Holy Ghost.
You may then ask why would confession be necessary?
From an LDS perspective, I believe the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS church) is the restored church and opperates similar to how it opperated in the Old Testament, New Testament, and Book of Mormon times as you can see from many of the comments made on this post (see comments #3, #6, #15, #16). The bishops/clergy are not the one’s who forgive, but are the one’s who are there to coach and guide and who are there as judges for the church, but not there to grant forgiveness to individuals.
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April 7, 2008 at 6:25 pm
Standing Solus Christus
[…] there destination when they are also made through His name. Consequently, those who solicit other mediators to address their prayers to or through are neglecting the only efficient and sufficient name under […]
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April 7, 2008 at 9:23 pm
Dan
I know that I read a story somewhere, I think in, The Miracle of Forgiveness, by Spencer W. Kimble, about a couple that had fornicated. They subsequently got married but apparently never forgot the guilt and never confessed.
They finally confessed when they were very old. They went in to see their bishop and told him what they had done many decades earlier, and they wondered if they could be forgiven for a sin that they had carried around so long without confessing to the proper authority.
The bishop, after hearing their confession frankly told them that they had been forgiven long before, and that he wished that they would’ve confessed to their bishop earlier just so they wouldn’t have to carry around the burden of guilt for so many years.
I have never walked out of a bishop’s office after having confessed various indiscretions without feeling better about myself and my relationship with the Lord afterwards.
Men are that they might have joy. The Lord wants us to be happy. Confession to a bishop, when appropriate, helps to facilitate that.
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April 11, 2008 at 7:06 am
NM
The book of Hebrews is a good reason for why we do not need humans or sacrificing of animals to mediate us with God…
The author of Hebrews makes comments about how exponentially greater Jesus is than any of what the Hebrews thought highly of, ie. the law, Moses, Joshua, angels, priesthoods etc…
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May 2, 2008 at 2:05 am
Confession « Sunrise Tantalize
[…] Grace for Grace post The law governing confession Which sins do you confess to the bishop Confession […]
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December 4, 2008 at 8:02 am
Ryan
Story time.
I had a girlfriend before who I felt I went too far with. We never had sex, but we had done some things (i.e. removing each others’ clothes) which I thought needed to be confessed to the Bishop. I set up an appointment and talked to him about it. He asked me if I was sorry for what I had done. I said I was. He asked if I was going to do it again. I said no. I thought for sure he was going to tell me I couldn’t go to the temple or take the sacrament for a while. But he didn’t. In fact, he told me that the sooner I went to the temple the better. I remember when I left his office that Sunday afternoon I had this overwhelming sense of peace flowing through me. I have been trying to figure out ever since if I actually even needed to talk to him about it. Considering that there was no formal disciplinary action taken, did I really need to confess what I had done? The answer I keep getting back is yes. Because even though there was no formal punishment or anything, I gained a peace of mind and a sense of forgiveness that I hadn’t been able to get up to that point. I don’t know if I would ever have been able to feel that sense of relief if I had never talked to him because I would have always wondered.
Basically, what I learned from that experience was that I cannot deny the spirit that I’m feeling. If the spirit is nudging me to tell the Bishop something, I need to do it. We all have the light of Christ and we all know when we’ve gone too far. It’s not something that can be explained because every individual is different. But it’s better to be safe than sorry, isn’t it? I want to get married in the temple. If I do something with my fiancee that could in ANY way jeopardize my worthiness to enter the temple, I need to tell the Bishop. (By the way, that’s another key. If what you are doing or have done might prevent you from worthily entering the temple, you probably should talk to the Bishop). I don’t want to enter the temple HOPING that I’m worthy to be there. I want to enter KNOWING that I am. I don’t want to take the Sacrament on Sunday HOPING that I am worthy to do so. I want to do it KNOWING that I am.
I think that anybody who tries to rationalize and say they don’t need to talk to the Bishop, and says stuff like, “Well, people talk to the Bishop too much about stuff they shouldn’t anyway” are in most cases ignoring what the Spirit is telling them.
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August 24, 2011 at 10:13 pm
mijoma
Hi, I know this convo is dead like 3 years ago, but I wanted to post what I read in another thread that I feel is worth noting:
Brigham Young, 10 March 1860:—“I believe in coming out and being plain and honest with that which should be made public, and in keeping to yourselves that which should be kept. If you have your weaknesses, keep them hid from your brethren as much as you can. You never hear me ask the people to tell their follies. But when we ask the brethren, as we frequently do, to speak in sacrament meetings, we wish them, if they have injured their neighbours, to confess their wrongs; but do not tell about your nonsensical conduct that nobody knows of but yourselves. Tell to the public that which belongs to the public. If you have sinned against the people, confess to them. If you have sinned against a family or a neighbourhood, go to them and confess. If you have sinned against your Ward, confess to your Ward. If you have sinned against one individual, take that person by yourselves and make your confession to him. And if you have sinned against your God, or against yourselves, confess to God, and keep the matter to yourselves, for I do not want to know anything about it. . . . Keep your follies that do not concern others to yourselves, and keep your private wickedness as still as possible; hide it from the eyes of the public gaze as far as you can, and make the people believe that you are filled with the wisdom of God. I wish to say this upon this particular point in regard to people’s confessing. We wish to see people honestly confess as they should and what they should.” (In Journal of Discourses, vol. 8 [Liverpool: George Q. Cannon, 1861], p. 362.)
Brigham Young, 9 November 1856:—“Confess your faults to the individuals that you ought to confess them to, and proclaim them not on the house tops. Be careful that you wrong not yourselves. Do you not know that if a good person is guilty of committing a crime he thinks that everybody knows it, and is ready to confess here, and there, and everywhere he has an opportunity? I do not want to know anything about the sins of this people, at least no more than I am obliged to. If persons lose confidence in themselves, it takes away the strength, faith and confidence that others have in them; it leaves a space that we call weakness. If you have committed a sin that no other person on the earth knows of, and which harms no other one, you have done a wrong and sinned against your God, but keep that within your own bosom, and seek to God and confess there, and get pardon for your sin. If children have sinned against their parents, or husbands against their wives, or wives against their husbands, let them confess their faults one to another and forgive each other, and there let the confession stop; and then let them ask pardon from their God. Confess your sins to whoever you have sinned against, and let it stop there. If you have committed a sin against the community, confess to them. If you have sinned in your family, confess there. Confess your sins, iniquities, and follies, where that confession belongs, and learn to classify your actions. Suppose that the people were to get up here and confess their sins, it would destroy many innocent persons. Does Texas know about it? No, nor you about one another, if you will be wise and confess your wrongs where they ought to be confessed, and keep the knowledge of them from every person it ought to be kept from. In this way you will have strength against the enemy, who would otherwise buffet you and say, ‘Here is your wickedness made manifest,’ and would overcome you and destroy all the confidence you have in yourselves and in your God. If the Lord has confidence in you, preserve it, and take a course to produce more.” (In Journal of Discourses, vol. 4 [Liverpool: S. W. Richards, 1857], pp. 78–79.)
Brigham Young, 4 January 1852:—“Some men who have been ordained unto the Priesthood and [who] are very high in authority, will take the name of God in vain, and swear by this and that. Do such persons suppose that the Church can forgive that sin? If you do, your hope is vain. They can never forgive that sin! No man can do it. None but God alone [can forgive that sin], and it never will be forgiven, until He does it. . . . If you sin against God and take the name of God in vain, if you get forgiveness, it will have to be forgiven by Him and not from man. . . . If you take the name of God in vain, I will not forgive it, for I cannot. . . . If you blaspheme the name of God, don’t ask this people to forgive you, for they cannot do it. You may ask them to pray [to] God to [have Him] forgive you. . . . Now brethren, if you sin against God, go to God to get forgiveness. . . . If you sin against your brother, go to him to get forgiveness. Ask forgiveness at the hands of the innocent. If you sin against your family, your parents, your husband, your wife, [or] your children, seek forgiveness at their hands. But what is done in secret, should be forgiven in secret and go no further, that sins may be hid. But if sins are committed openly, they should ask forgiveness and be forgiven openly. These are true principles and let them be remembered forever.” (Teachings of President Brigham Young; vol. 3 [Salt Lake City, Utah: Collier’s Publishing Co., October 1987]; pp. 6–7, 8, 9.)
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August 25, 2011 at 4:55 am
graceforgrace
mijoma,
This is a very good addition to the conversation even though it’s a few years ago. Thank you for stopping by and leaving this. I have to say I agree with Brigham Young on those points. God is the judge and we shouldn’t feel like we have to run to clergy to obtain forgiveness.
That being said, do you feel there are certain “big” sins we should go to clergy for such as fornication, murder, drugs, etc.? Or do you think confessing to God is enough for all sins regardless of how “big’ they are?
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November 17, 2011 at 10:52 pm
Convert
Your last question is the exact question I am researching, but I’m questioning it all a step further. Why do we need to confess to God at all? He already knows, what we did, he knew right when we were doing it and even knew our thoughts before we actually did it. He also knows if we are sorry and have learned our lesson and knows our heart and of our sincere promise to ourselves to never do it again. So what is the point of repeating it all to anyone, God, the Bishop, or even the individual you sinned against? I am wondering if Heavenly Father thinks the whole repentence process is redundant. Thoughts?
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November 28, 2011 at 7:32 pm
MIchael, the Rejected of all, a servant of Christ and a saint of Christ
I confess my sins that I am worthy of the priesthood, who keep the law of chastity, the word of wisdom, keep the ten commandments of God, but, I cannot assist to the House of the Lord due to deficiency of the brain that I am not well sufficiently prepared to go the House of the Lord. If I go to the House of the Lord, will damage me and destroy my self esteem and my life. So, I am still worthy of the Lord and keep the law of chastity and the ten commandments. I offer my condolences to the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Days Saints, that I am worthy to receive the Holy Priesthood and well prepared but I am not sufficiently spiritually prepared to be in the Holy House of God, due to chemical imbalance. I am prepared to stay out of the House of God, and I rather choose to stay outside and live happily and serving God and keep his commandments and living worthily of God and keeping his commandments. Even though I do not belong the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Days Saints, it does not mean I will forsake the commandments because I love to keep the commandments for they are my delight since in my infancy. I keep the ten commandments as though I have written the ten commandments and have given the law to Moses. I mean, I keep the ten commandments and make my own rules and the ten commandments are written in my soul, heart and mind. Even I am cast away of the Church of Jesus Christ, does not mean I will change. I am that I am, and cannot change. I am the way I am and keep my commandments, and they are: Thou shalt not steal, thou shalt no covet the wife of they neighbor, thou not bow and worship other gods before me, thou shalt not take the name of God in vain, thou shalt work six days, thou shalt keep the Sabbath day to rest, and thou shalt not commit adultery, thou shalt not kill, and thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself, and thou shalt make graven image of God or make a statue or serve them or make an image graven of the heavens or under the heavens or the earth, and thou shalt love the Lord with all of thy strength and might and heart. I keep the law of chastity, the word of wisdom, and read the word of God which is infallible and immutable word of God, for this is the word of God whose God is the inaccessible light that no man can approach. I rather choose to be living as an evangelical which is my life whom I have grown up and want to live my life as an evangelical and do not want to continue as a Mormon and I am happy living with my life in Christ that lives in me and I am happy. I do not want to go where my service to God is disrupted.
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November 29, 2011 at 6:33 am
graceforgrace
Michael,
Thanks for sharing your thoughts. Tell me more about what you mean that you have an imbalance and therefore can’t go into the temple?
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